Some corals doing great, but others fade away...?

[glocklt4]

Temp: 78F
SG: 1.0026
NH3: 0
NO2: <.1
NO3: <10
Last light change was 3mo ago.
flow: 1- MJ1200 plus sump pump with two nozzles (forget flow on it)

Will get other params tonight and post

Basically i have a bunch of Kenya tree that's doing really well and growing fine. I also have 2-3 species of mushroom that are doing really well - opening up huge. Then I have some GSP (not sure which one) that is doing ok. Not growing too much but also not fading or anything - opens up daily. Some other small polp that's yellowish green in individual stalks (no purple base "skin")... not sure what it's called. Doing ok, but not growing or spreading like it used to.

Anyway, 6 months ago I'd say, somehow I let my salinity/SpecificGravity get up to 1.030-1.031. Not sure how that happened exactly. The first sign something was wrong was that my 8-10 stalk frogspawn started to fade and melt, then some of my second GSP species wouldn't open. Once i found the problem i corrected the salinity over a few days. It ended up being too late for both of these and they faded away. Also some of the yellow/green polyps disappeared.

2 weeks ago I got some pom pom xenia from a forum member, probably 4-5 small frags and they were doing great for 2 days, but now they are shriveled and only 2 left. I also got one stalk of frog spawn again from my dad, and it looks "ok".

So how is it that some soft corals do SO well (kenya tree/mushrooms), but then others do not? I realize that each species has it's own "perfect" water params, but I thought that most softies would not be too far off from each other and be pretty easy to maintain.

 

[mukymuk]

There is far more that we don't understand about our tanks than we do. So while easily measurable parameters might be spot on, there's dozens of other factors that we can't easily quantify that might be way off.

I have a hunch that nutrition and allelopathy are significant players in instances of "fade-out". Also, I think we tend to oversimplify and/or homogenize the needs of our livestock. I think there is far more critical variability in the needs of our animals than we realize. It pays to study the environment where these animals come from (which is, unfortunately, easier said than done).

 

[washingtond]

Sometimes it is difficult to say why corals do well and others do not in the same tank. There could be chemical warfare going on between the corals, the water conditions are not correct for some corals etc. What are your calcium and alkalinity levels? Also how often do you do water changes?

 

[glocklt4]

@washingtond wrote:

Yeah, that's possible. I will have cal and alk params posted tonight. Water changes are once a month, 20%.

 

[Rick]

Without knowing all of your tanks numbers and certainly low alkalinity or something else could be the issue. One thing that hits me in your tank description is that you have one maxi-jet and just the returns for flow in a 72 gallon tank. Flow in a reef tank is as important as lighting and good water. That seems to me like it could be a very real issue with your tank. If corals have an abundance of light on them they need a lot of flow across them or they shut down. Corals respirate like any animal, the more light on them, the faster they respirate, the more they respirate the more flow they need to take away the Co2 produced and supply new oxygen. Too much light, too little flow and they shut down. Much like you would if you ran a marathon and had your head in a paper bag with a tiny hole in the end. That may explain the difference in some things doing well and other corals not well. Whether or not you find any other things wrong with your water chemistry I think you need to increase flow through out the tank.

 

[glocklt4]

@Rick wrote:

Thanks for the advice Rick. I have been thinking about adding more flow anyway since i see many people with nice reefs having a lot of power heads running. I will add another to try and get some more turbulent water circulation going on and we'll see what happens.

 

[glocklt4]

Ok, been a busy past couple of days.. ugh.

PH is 8.1
Ca = 380
Alk = 100

Xenia is nearly gone now - very small. GSP still hasn't opened up and is starting to get the brownish red on it like i've seen before when it's fading away.

 

[Jeff]

100? Really? Is that mq/l? How are you reading that and what kit is it?

 

[Rick]

@DheereCrossing wrote:

That would be a good question to answer and quickly. If that really is a meq/l reading of 1.00 your alkalinity is really really low.

 

[glocklt4]

I'm using the Hagen Master kit... I am at work so I'm not sure exactly what the measurement is. Hmm.... crap!


Edit , just remembered that I did a Carbonate Hardness test, not a true Alk test. That may be the reason for the difference. there was kH and gH, and that's it. Maybe I need to get a true Alk tester??

Found a pretty darn good explanation of the two:

http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f6/confused-with-alkalinity-vs-carbonate-hardness-test-kit-same-141014.html

However this is confusing since it says that Carbonate Hardness (or Carbonate Alkalinity) is the same thing as Alkalinity. Can't trust Wikipedia 100% though, ha:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbonate_hardness

This also contradicts and says i measured the right thing. I think I'm reporting in mg or something else though:

http://saltwater-aquarium-guide.net/carbonate-hardness-in-your-saltwater-aquarium

 

[Rick]

@glocklt4 wrote:

Checking carbonate hardness (alkalinity)
Measuring carbonate hardness is referred to as measuring the alkalinity of the water, but this different to the pH measurement that is alkaline. Carbonate hardness affect pH, but you’re not measuring pH. Carbonate hardness can be measured with a test kit. It may be called as alkalinity test kit. It is usually reported in milli-equivalents per liter (meq/L). The level in your aquarium should be greater than 3.0 meq/L.

 

[glocklt4]

@Rick wrote:

Checking carbonate hardness (alkalinity)
Measuring carbonate hardness is referred to as measuring the alkalinity of the water, but this different to the pH measurement that is alkaline. Carbonate hardness affect pH, but you’re not measuring pH. Carbonate hardness can be measured with a test kit. It may be called as alkalinity test kit. It is usually reported in milli-equivalents per liter (meq/L). The level in your aquarium should be greater than 3.0 meq/L."]


Ok, thanks. I will try to find out what the measurement type is for the Hagen Master kit so that I have a better idea of what is going on.


Edit: it appears that it's in mg/L.

mEq to mg appears to be: 10meq=800mg or 1 meq=80mg , so that says I'm at 1.25 mEq/L. Time to use some buffer to get that up i guess!

 

[glocklt4]

I took readings again tonight and it came up at 90 mg/L, or (according to the conversion in the test kit - 1.8 mEq/L). So obviously that is pretty low. I got almost 3 teaspoons of buffer added which is supposed to raise it by .25 mEq/L and I'll have to do that for about a week. Any idea what causes this to drop? I thought that salt from water changes was supposed to help maintain these levels pretty well on their own.

 

[Jeff]

Alk gets used up fairly quickly by corals. Perhaps the salt mix is low. Try mixing up some new water and test that before using it. Sometimes the manufacturer forgets to add it or if the bucket settles out and isn't mixed right you can get low or high on one element or another. I'd also advise either getting another test kit to check your first one and/or take some new water and some tank water to a good LFS or another hobbyist and have tests run there.

 

[glocklt4]

@DheereCrossing wrote:

Thanks for the recommendation. I'll give it a shot.

 

[Rick]

@glocklt4 wrote:

That would depend on how often you do water changes and how large each water change was. And in a a heavily stocked tank you would have to do water changes every few days to keep up with the alkalinity no matter what salt you used. You should be looking at your alkalinity and maintaining every week. Your calcium every two weeks and your magnesium once a month at a minimum.

 

[bimmerzs]

@Rick wrote:

And that again depends on what your tank's consumption is....for example my tank can drop 1.5-2 dKH a day if not buffered. I suggest getting your alk to the level you want it at, then track your consumption for a week to figuring out how much you need to dose daily to maintain it at that level.

Cheers,

 

[glocklt4]

Looks like i've gotten alk up to 3.8 now, so much better. I accidentally overdosed using more than 3 teaspoons the first night without knowing it until the next night so it climbed a bit faster than I wanted. Anyway, I'll keep an eye on the corals and see if they start looking better. I don't know that the mushrooms and kenya trees can get any better though, ha.