Plumbing frustrations

B

blide

Alright I've tried to figure this out and it's just not working out right. My goal was to create a quiet setup and just do some simple plumbing and it's turned into a huge frustration.

1st problem: I'm using a new ATB Flow Star 1500 and seems to be a really good pump, but I think it's to strong for my tank (AGA 150g dual overflow). When I first setup the tank I didn't put a Tee in the line, so I thought maybe that's why it's to strong because it's pushing too much water into the overflows. So, I put in a Tee and it's a 1/4 inch line back into the skimmer section of the sump, but it's still causing the overflow to take on too much water. I just don't get it! Now it seems I have too much water going through the overflows (still gurgling) and too much water being pushed through sump because of the Tee (micro bubbles in the display. I've searched all over the Internet reading forums and people seem to use this pump on smaller tanks than mine, so that's what makes it even more frustrating because they're not having the issue.

2nd problem: The return line plumbing is making a loud hum and I know it's vibration in the line because when I grab the pipe from the pump it silences and I feel the vibration. I can't tell if the water preasure is backing up and causing the line to vibrate or it's just vibrating on it's own. The pump has rubber feet and when I run it in a trash can with no plumbing it's completely silent. I'm using 3/4 inch PVC from pump to the returns with gate valves for water control. Do you guys think I should change it all over to 1 inch spaflex to slow down the water and hopefully elminate the hum? It's getting really annoying because the line is mounted to the wall frame and I can hear it on the opposite side of the wall.

Details:
1 1/2 durso stand pipes
1 inch spa flex drain lines
1 inch bulkhead drains
3/4 bulk head returns
3/4 PVC return lines

Here's a pic of the plumbing:
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plumbing sucks, i wasted like 500 bucks on parts before i just called true plumbing, best thing i did and if you keep having problems thats what id recommend. good luck!
 
Your returns for a 1500 pump should be a pair of 1", not 3/4". That will significantly reduce the hum.
I would also gate valve your drains and the single feed off your return pump to feed your 1" returns.
you can split them inside the tank into 3/4" locline wyes of you want a more diverse flow. The test container also wasn't rigid which provided some hum dampening whereas your sump is acrylic with no dampening effect.

For the record, I'm using a Laguna Powerflo 1500 on my 150 with 2 x 1" drains and 1" main return TEEd to the sides of the main returns and then Wyed inside the tank with loclines. I have a very quiet setup (if the skimmer's off).
I have the return valve closed by about 25% to match my drain ability wide open (my drains have ball valves which limit the drain GPH)
 
Right after your return pump, insert some Spaflex. Right above the union before the coupling, that will dampen the vibration issue.

What is the water level in your overflows? The water shouldn't fall more than 2" at the most.

Where is the 1/4" tubing you talked about? I don't see it.
 
Sorry Marc I meant to type 1/2 pipe... Here's a video of the setup and you'll see it start having issues shortly after the video starts. Plus I added a small amount of flex pipe to the return, but it didn't do much (I'm thinking it's too short)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIMlxRERNoU[/youtube]
 
What happens if you take the cap off does level stay the same if it does you will need to drill a bigger hole in my opinion


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@kuyatwo wrote:
What happens if you take the cap off does level stay the same if it does you will need to drill a bigger hole in my opinion said:
I've tried various hole sizes from 1/16 up to 1/8 and there's always a gurgle at some point. I've now put some tubing in the hole to reduce the size and I also have an airline adapter to reduce the air even more for testing.

One thing I just don't understand is why only the left overflow water level is going up and down. The right side is steady and both durso's are the same size (measured again just to make sure).

So do you guys think I should convert all the return pvc under the tank to 1" spa flex? Since I have to use the 3/4 bulkhead on the tank I wouldn't think using 1" in the overflow after the bulkhead would change much?

Thanks for the input...
Click to expand...
 
Somebody might chime in but I think you are having a whirlpool effect in your piping that is why it is going up and down. How many angles going from the bulkhead to the sump?


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Just watched the video. The drain lines in the sump need to be submerged not more than 1". I'd suggest 1/2". Everything else looks good.

You should try some filter floss under the return pump as a cushion and see if that helps.
 
What Marc said. Raise your drain pipes.

Also, Durso's are noisy - Herbies, if you have a second line available for backup, are the way to go. Least amount of pipe, dead silent.
 
I think the return lines are too small. I work with fire pumps and when we send water through a small pipe, even schedule 40 steel vibrates so loud you take a couple steps back. It should be at least a 1" coming out of the pump and split off to 3/4". On my 125 I have a Snapper and the discharge is plumbed with 1-1/4" then splits off to the skimmer and the calcium reactor and then drops to the (2) 3/4" returns.
Someone also said you had a whirlpool effect. I think this is what's happening. It seems like the water in those almost straight pipes is creating a vacuum. I don't know how since you have air bleeds in the top of the dursos. Can you take the top of the durso off and see if it still does that?
 
Thanks for the input guys. I'm going to swap the return plumbing today over to 1" spaflex and change the 1/2 line back to the sump to 3/4. I'll post the results.
 
Well after another trip to Lowes and hours of worked I've changed over all the main lines to 1" spa flex and 3/4 pvc and it's really quiet now! [smilie=clapping.gif]

Thanks for all the input guys... Here's a pic and a video:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TVyqM-XF98[/youtube]
 
It looks great. Nice job. Are you going to run filter socks?
 
@Marc wrote:
It looks great. Nice job. Are you going to run filter socks? said:
I had them in the sump when I first started up the tank, but it's pretty loud with water splashing into the socks. I'll probably just run them ever so often.

Oh and I noticed you run them sometimes and I wanted to ask if you take off the submerged pipe when you have them on or do you just fit the sock around them? I pulled the pipe off because I was nervous it would clog the the outlets with the submerged pipes.
Click to expand...
 
I've only begun to run socks and already hate the headache about having to clean them. You do want the pipes underneath. You always want the pipe submerged 1/2" under the water surface.
 
If they clog, It'll just overflow over the filter sock. You have nothing to worry about....other than a little splashing. I also hate cleaning those darn things weekly !!
 
I used to run filter socks. I took them out because as most stated they are just a PITA. Most of the dietrus settles in the fuge section of my sump. When I do water changes I just put a pump in there and stir it up. Sucks out a lot of junk.
 
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