Mike's 260g Rimless Starphire Build

I'll try and take some more pictures this weekend :) (I know, I keep saying I'll get updates done by X date)

So I was able to get a few things done over Thanksgiving and the past few days. Some of the updates were on the QT and I'll post those pics when I get a chance.


First, I had a little trouble with my Apex. I was tying in my back-up float switches and messed a few things up and started deleting virtual outlets which really then messed things up. Genius that I am, I had no backup saved for my Apex program thinking most of my programming was pretty simple. Even though it was, it took a while to re-initialize bus addresses, outlets, and reprogram things to get back to where I was. Needless to say, I now have backups of my program.

Second, I was able to get my wiring organized and cleaned-up a bit. That process probably took about 8 - 10 hours total time! Probe wires were tangled together with power cords and had to be pulled, labeled, and rerouted. A few other things were haphazardly thrown in so those had to be redone as well.

Here's how the back of the stand looks now:
[attachment=2]IMG_0288.JPG[/attachment]
Excess cords are bundled up and harnesses are done and cleaned-up. Cords touching the floor have been minimized to one degree or another.

And the main electronics bay wall:
[attachment=1]IMG_0290.JPG[/attachment]
As you can see, I have fully utilized both EB8s and there are also two power strips fed off the EB8s. One is for the 5 AI Vega fixtures and the other is for wall warts for constant power items like the doser, wireless access point, Vega Controller, and skimmer airflow meter. In looking at this, I can probably clean it up a but more but it is functional for now. You can also see the split loom I used along the bottom for the door switches. I also added a small fan for some airflow away from the electronics section.

Here's the back wall of the electronics bay:
[attachment=0]IMG_0291.JPG[/attachment]
This section is smaller and just has the 3 MP40 controllers, WXM, and power supplies for the MP40s. I wanted to keep the power supplies off the ground and off the floor of the stand should something leak or flood.
 
The two controller interfaces are velcro attached to the doser bracket so they can be pulled out and adjusted. The controllers face the front of the stand:
[attachment=1]IMG_0292.JPG[/attachment]

I also thought about probe replacement in the future. I went with split loom for the probe wiring as it will be easier to pull one and replace it as opposed to using a billion little zip ties that would have to be cut:
[attachment=0]IMG_0293.JPG[/attachment]

Next up will be programming and setting up the WXM and started the Red Sea Coral Pro Coloration testing and dosing! If I like the Red Sea program, I may have to figure out a way to build a sub-stand to place in the electronics bay for additional dosers and supplements.

I also still need to construct the battery back-up system once I can convince the wife it won't be an eyesore. That may involve getting a custom cabinet built to match the stand . . . so this will probably be a longer term project.
 
I need to hire you to clean up my Giant Rats nest under/behind my tank !! Nice job. So very clean it almost makes me want to replicate it.............. [smilie=smile.gif]
 
Now that is how it should be done! That looks really great. Nice idea about Velcro for the controllers. I will have to use that one.
 
Thanks guys, I hope to get some updates posted on the QT and maybe start the Red Sea coloration program if I can get some time to do some testing. Yesterday was a lot busier than I expected so I didn't get a chance to do anything tank related. [smilie=sadsmile.gif]
 
What size QT will you have for this system? Also, I was looking at the Red Sea coloration program also. Please post if and when you start it with parameters of your tank before you start and as you go along. That would be really helpful to many of us. Again, you have an awesome setup. Great work.
 
@hoopsdaddy wrote:
What size QT will you have for this system? Also said:
There is 40B setup as a QT/hospital tank. I think I've got some info a page or two back in this log but will have something more detailed soon in an article type format with accompanying pictures. My next post here will be about the coloration program as I did get a chance to mess with it yesterday and do some testing. Give me a few minutes and I'll have it posted up. [smilie=smile.gif]
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<u>Red Sea Color Program:</u>

So I had time to finally break out the Red Sea color program. Here's all the stuff I ordered:
[attachment=2]IMG_0296.JPG[/attachment]
Almost looks like an advertisement for their stuff! I went ahead and just got the 500ml bottles of each as I looked at how much would be needed for my TWV. Those 500ml bottles of Reef Energy may only last a little over 2 weeks.

<u>Test Kits:</u>
I started out with the test kits for Iodine (really iodide & iodate), Iron, and Potassium. I liked the Red Sea kit as it tests for both iodide and iodate. For a good read on testing iodine and its forms go here: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2003/3/chemistry

There is a LOT of stuff in this combined test kit and if you thought testing Mg was a pain, wait until you try the K test with the filter paper, 4 reagents, and 25 minute total waiting time:
[attachment=1]IMG_0298.JPG[/attachment]
At least the Potassium kit is a titration test. The others involve color cards. Iron is the easiest test. Iodine is the next most complicated and the Potassium is the most complicated test I've seen yet. The kit comes with a lot but it could use an extra 5ml syringe and a couple more test tube type bottles. I had a few extras lying around so I put them in another test kit case so I could do all 3 tests at ones and have my waiting times overlap. A couple of cheap stopwatches wouldn't hurt either. Otherwise, there is a lot of waiting, rinsing, and waiting some more as the reagents do their thing. If you want some more details on the steps involved and how to do the tests you can find them online here along with some YouTube video links: http://www.redseafish.com/index.aspx?id=4362

Side note, I was checking for information regarding the accuracy of the kits and there are different numbers given on different vendor websites. I'll just go by the margin of error listed on the Red Sea website and if my numbers are within the margin of error, I will leave them alone.

<u>My Starting Parameters:</u>
I had completed my 10% water change in the morning (25 gallons based on 250g TWV) and, in the evening my starting parameters (and method of testing) are as follows:

<u>Salinity:</u> 35ppt (Hanna Digital Refractometer & Apex Conductivity Probe)
<u>Temperature:</u> 78F (Apex Temp Probe, drain side)
<u>pH:</u> 8.19 (Apex pH probe)
<u>Ammonia:</u> Undetectable (API)
<u>Nitrite:</u> Undetectable (API)
<u>Nitrate:</u> Undetectable (API)
<u>Alkalinity:</u> 8.5 dKh (Red Sea Pro)
<u>Calcium:</u> 430 ppm (Red Sea Pro)
<u>Magnesium:</u> 1360 (Red Sea Pro)
<u>Phosphate:</u> 0.00 ppm (Hanna Checker)
<u>Iodide & Iodate:</u> 0.045 ppm (Red Sea Pro)
<u>Iron:</u> 0.00 ppm (Red Sea Pro)
<u>Potassium:</u> 410 ppm (Red Sea Pro)

My current dosing regimen is to autodose 150ml of BRS Recipe 1 Alkalinity and 180ml of BRS Calcium daily. I also dose BRS Magnesium daily but forgot to write down what it is.

<u>Reef Colors Dosing:</u>
Based on my test results, it looks like I have good starting levels of Iodine and Potassium although that could be due to the recent water change. I couldn't really tell whether my Iodine was at 0.03 or 0.06 so I averaged it out. I will test again at the end of 5 days to see if there is a change and figure out dosing of Reef Colors "A" and "B" at that time. Because my iron levels are not detectable, I started with the recommended dosage of 50ml of Reef Colors "C" to bring it up 0.05ppm which is the most they say to raise it in a day. I will test iron daily until I get iron levels in-range.

Reef Colors "D" only gives dosing instructions based on your usage of Red Sea's calcium supplement or a Calcium reactor. I went conservative on this and am only adding 15ml a day.

I suppose the iron deficiency may be limiting my macroalgae and may be contributing to some of stubborn areas where cyano has not gone away. I found these articles to be a good primer on iron and the reef aquarium:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/8/chemistry
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/10/chemistry

If I notice a difference with this dosing, I see a Vertex Libra in my future [smilie=lol.gif]. I guess I would just build a stand for the Vertex, have the bottles under the stand, and run the dosing tubes out of my equipment area like what I've done with the Bubble Magus. I'd go with a Vertex for the higher accuracy of the pumps . . . and because it is new and looks cool. [smilie=smile.gif]

<u>Reef Nutrition:</u>
Red Sea's instructions call for 2 ml/day per 25 gallons of water for each of their Reef Energy "A" and Reef Energy "B" supplements for growth when you have higher "foundation" elements (Alk, Ca, Mg) and 4ml/day per 25 gallons for ULNS and better coloration with lower "foundation" elements. I never really thought of myself as running a ULNS as I feed daily but my numbers seem to fall in-line with ULNS plus the GFO reactor and constant skimming. I have opted for 30ml/day of each as a starting point.

Note that this stuff also needs to be refrigerated after opening. You know you are a reef geek when 1/2 your freezer is full of frozen fish food you got a good deal on and bottles of phyto and other reef stuff starts crowding out your own food in the fridge . . . but I digress . . .

So this stuff is a radioactive nuclear highlighter yellow that Homer Simpson would be proud of. After adding it to my tank, my water looked like this:
[attachment=0]IMG_0295.JPG[/attachment]

You are supposed to leave your skimmer off but keep flow on for 15 - 30 minutes so I have dedicated Feed Mode "D" on my Apex to just shutting down the skimmer for 30 minutes. There is a 5 minute Defer command at the end of my skimmer program so it will be off for a total of 35 minutes when feeding this stuff.

I noted that my skimmer cleaned-up the water pretty quickly and gathered lots of skimmate after feeding so it should have removed the excess.

I will update this as testing, dosing, and with my results, if any.
 
Mike,
That is exactly how I was hoping that you would write it up. Great job. I am going to be following this closely as I was very interested in this when I was reading up on it. Thank you for being so through. Are you running bio-pellets also or just the GFO?
Also, I would be interested in knowing the average monthly cost associated with this program. I can look up the cost of the start up, but your tank size is similar to mine and that would give me an estimated cost. I realize that it will vary dependent upon a variety of factors(water changes, skimmer, coral choice, feeding schedule, ect) but it would be interesting to know.
Thanks again for such a great write up and I will review the articles links you posted.
 
Great setup. Love your rock work, mix of corals, and placement of corals.

My 2 cents on dosing amino's/boosters - use half of what is suggested.

Thanks for sharing your build.
 
Wow... The color program looks like it is a very expensive PITA. I sure hope your results are pretty incredible to justify the time and money.
 
@hoopsdaddy wrote:
Mike said:
Thanks for all the kind words! I am just running GFO and carbon. I haven't had a need to go with a biopellet reactor yet given my whopping bioload of 5 small fish so far [smilie=lol.gif]. I do have a spot to add a biopellet reactor and an extra feed off one of my manifolds for it if I need to go that route later.

Yeah, I'll be interested to see what it adds up to myself and see if I get any noticeable improvements to justify the cost. I'll update this with whatever my dosing ends up being and will figure it out if I can get everything dialed in. One of the things I will test for this weekend is my NSW (which is made with Red Sea Coral Pro) to see how that tests out. The instructions give doses for 25g increments which works out perfectly as I do 25g water changes.

@steelcaveman wrote:
Great setup. Love your rock work said:
Thank you very much! I'm already running at less than what they recommend but yeah, my tank looks like a yellow highlighter took a dump in it for a few hours after adding that stuff so I may cut back even more.

@Titus wrote:
Wow... The color program looks like it is a very expensive PITA. I sure hope your results are pretty incredible to justify the time and money. said:
Indeed, but then again, what isn't in this hobby [smilie=smile.gif] If I get the results I want, I will just automate the dosing to take away the PITA part leaving just the cost of the stuff but which will involve more expensive gadgetry. The actual stuff was about $76 for all the supplements and the trio of test kits was about $65 just going by BRS prices so not too bad in the grand scheme of things I suppose.

<u>Update on Fe dosing:</u>
So 24 hours after adding 50ml of Reef Color "C" to get my Fe levels up . . . . nothing. Fe still read as undetectable by the kit. They said that Fe is used up faster than anything else in their program. So I went ahead and did two doses of 50ml (total of 100ml) and tested an hour later. This time it was at the 0.05 mark. I'll test again tomorrow night before adding anymore but man, if the Fe gets used up that quickly I'll be buying a ton of that particular supplement. I'm hoping it is something like Mg that just initially takes a lot to get it to where it needs to be and then just a bit to maintain . . . probably not though.
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On a 260 gallon tank the color program will be expensive. You might want to do more frequent water changes and do the reef color program. If you have macro algae I bet that is soaking a lot up


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
@kuyatwo wrote:
On a 260 gallon tank the color program will be expensive. You might want to do more frequent water changes and do the reef color program. If you have macro algae I bet that is soaking a lot up Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk said:
Yeah, I'm thinking the macro has been sucking up the Fe in the water too which is why I figure it will be interesting to see what my NSW levels are at. My macro took off in the beginning and then didn't grow a whole lot, perhaps due to Fe as the limiting factor.

As to the cost statement and the part about this stuff being a pain I think an accurate statement would read:

"On a 260 gallon tank the _________________ will be expensive and a pain" where you can insert anything into the blank line. [smilie=wink.gif]
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Just a quick update on the iron test. Looks to be somewhere between the 0 and 0.5 mark (yeah, not very high resolution with the given measurement range) so I'll be adding another 50 ml tonight and 50 ml in the morning to see where that gets me. At this rate, 1/2 the bottle will be gone in the morning. Guess I better start shopping for the Vertex Libra . . . and some more of this supplement
 
Added another dose of 100ml of Colors "C" (iron supplement) yesterday and levels have been consistently testing at 0.05. Looks like it will just take a lot to raise and maintain Fe levels. I'm almost out of the first 500ml bottle already so I plan on seeing if any LFS carry any to get me by until I can order it in bulk.

I re-tested Iodide/Iodate, Iron, and Potassium levels today as Red Sea recommends testing after 4 days to get an idea of consumption to figure out dosing. Here are my results as of tonight:

I = 0.06
Fe = 0.05
K = 410

So really no change in I or K (I didn't follow the right procedure on the iodine test the first time which is probably why it was lower and now higher). Good news is that I really won't need to dose Reef Colors "A" and "B" unless there is some sort of change. Most of my corals are frags so perhaps they just aren't using a lot? I am still dosing 15ml of Reef Colors "D" daily, 100ml of Reef Colors "C" as noted, and continuing with 30ml of Reef Energy "A" and 30ml of Reef Energy "B" daily.

I have noticed a little more algae on the glass so I can't really go a full week between cleanings now. Personally, I don't see any color changes yet but one big thing I noted was that the cyano in my fuge is all but gone!!! I had ready in one of Randy's articles that increasing iron may limit cyano for various reasons that he describes better than I ever could hope to. Well, it seems to be true in my case.

ETA: I will also send out a test sample of my water to the place Dennis posted about that can do lab grade tests to see how they compare to what I am getting from my kits. http://www.aquariumwatertesting.com/products-page/
 
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