Need advice - have lots of questions - Starting a saltwater aquarium tank...

C

clownfish74

[Hello,
I am new here and reading some posts I figured it would be best if I asked all my questions before I did anything ;-)

1) What size aquarium to get?
I've heard you should have at least a 50-60 gallon tank but on posts here I heard no less than a 180. Maybe that was for specific fish but what is a good size tank for an "average" fish. The only fish I know I want that I know the name of is a clownfish. I also may want the shrimp/lobster things as well. I thought I would look at pictures from this sites advertisers to list names here but it seems every store has different fish. I thought every store had much the same fish but alas, not the case, what a cool hobby to get into. The tank I'm thinking about getting is 125 gallons. I could not find many much bigger than that (only 1 actually). I currently have a 10 gallon tank but dont worry, only small fresh water fish in there.

2) What does live sand do?
I've heard of live rock and sortof know what it does in that things live in the rock and some plants could grow out of it (right?).

3) What is a really good fish store near White Settlement (West Fort Worth)? If there are none (real good) close, what is one medium distance? IE: Whats the best 1 or 2 stores for the distance to travel?

4) What is the water tanks under the aquarium tank (with the fish) used for?
I was at a store that had the regular fish tank with fish etc in it and below it, like in the cabinet, there were several other fish tanks that only had water. Is this some kind of super filter or something? Whats up?

5) How do you get the "accessories" attached to the fishtank?
With a glass top covering the whole top, how do the accessories attach to it without keeping the doors open?

6) How do I make salt-water?
I figure the easiest way is to get tap-water and put the salt pellets or whatever in it and youve got saltwater. However, I read that you dont want to use tap water because of the chemicals in it and that there was like this water purifier system or whatever that you could buy that would "make" good water for salt water tank. I'm guessing its something like a britta filter system or something. Is any of this right?

7) Not quite a questions but a "do I have this right" sanity check. Here is what I think is needed for a tank and what it is used for. If you could fill in some blanks and add other things I will need/want/must have, it would be great.

Tank - obvious reasons - So far guessing at 125 gallons.

Lights - ? - why do you need them? what kind or type do you need? I see people saying 800 Watt bulb this or 700 Watt bulb that, are these really 800 and 700 watts? Like, almost a kWatt per hour. What is the electricity cost of these things?

Fish - I guess not required but for me less assume they are.

Water Filter - I've heard of differnt kinds but the only kind I am familiar with is the waterfall kind that serves dual purpose to put air into the water. I've heard of gravel filters, under something filters. What are they and what do you need? What do the different kinds really do?

Live Sand - dont know why?

Live Rock - looks good and gets you "plants" but not sure why required. Is it?

Heater?

What chemicals do you need except the stuff to make salt-water?


8) I read where invertibrates are very much harder to keep than just fish. Why? What kinds of things fall into the invertibrate category? Do shrimp? Clams?

9) I read that you need to have treated live rock or it will put amonia in tank and kill everything. Why would a store sell untreated live rock? What does it mean to be treated? Is that just having the live rock in another tank with only water for a period of time to de-amoniaize itself?

10) How much live rock should you have for a tank? I like the live rock but a friend had a tank that I thought had to much rock, it seemed cluttered to me. Do you have to fill tank with rocks?

11) What are some good and colorful fish to start with?


I guess thats it for now. Thanks in advance for all your help.

PS: Do any of you get together to enjoy each others tank? It would be a cool idea, I guess.]
 
[Clownfish welcome to the board.

Let me get you started then soem of teh more experienced folks can fill in anything I might have left out.


1. It is all in preference, you could get a smaller tank but water parameters would be a little more difficult to keep stable as you have have less volume. I think anything fromm a 55 to 125 would be a good tank to start with, I personnaly am seting up a 140.

2. A DSB(deep sand bed) acts as a filter, and it adds to the beauty of the Reef in my opinion.

3. Some of the folks that live out that way could answer this question better tahtn I can, but i do know there are a couple.

4. Marc's sump page

6. A reverse osmosis unit would be your first step to salt water. Second would be a bucket of salt from your LFS. Thirs would be a refractometer to ensure you have to have the correct salinity. Most folks use a power head to circulater the water and the salt until the salt is dissolved. In the end you want to make sure you have the same salinity and temp. as the tank water.


7. Lights: corals need light to survive and it requires differnt lights to keep differnt corals, some are more light hungry than others, this is just a skim over this topic there is alot to learn. There are basically two types of lights flouresencts-sp? and metal halide.

Water filter: There are several types of filtration at work on an average reef tank. The live sand and live rock act as a bilogical filter, A protein skimmer is a must IMO. Also alot of folks use a refugium for filtration(go to marcs page for info on this)

8. They require specific lighting and near perfect water conditions, but with the information on this site and other forums I dont think you would have any trouble. Everyone here is more thatn happy to help.

9. You can buy cured and uncured rock, cured rock will cost a little more per pound, but you will have less of an ammonia cycle, the ammonia spike is caused by the die off of the organisms living on the rock.



We do have monthly meetings at lfs or members homes, and we are in the planning stage of a tank tour on the FT Worth side.

Hope this helps a little, Im still new myself, teh other folks will fill in any blanks I might of left.

Take some time and read all you can, navigate around Marc's site he has a ton of good info and great pictured to go with everything.]
 
[Stop. Don't buy anything yet. You need to read some books

I started with Marine Aquariums by Nick Dakin. I am sure there are better books, that will be recomended by others on this forum.
There are other forums you need look in on start with http://reefcentral.com

This is an expensive hobby. get on some web sites and check out the prices of equipment to see if you want to jump in
try http://www.championlighting.com.

Welcome to the forum.

You will find alot of help here.

I hope to see you at the meeting]
 
[Well Welcome to the Hobby and the Forum!

I will attempt to answer some of your questions since Im new to the hobby as well.You'll learn very fast Trust me! Also feel free to give me a PM or a call if you ever need anything.This hobby is very fun and yet again can ber very frustrating at times.


#1. get any size tank that suits you!I must say that larger is better in the fact that bad things happen faster in small tanks than larger ones. IE :Salinity swings, ph , Alk, and temp all occur at a faster rate in smaller tanks. I myself started w/ a 55 and in 6 months Ive found that i wanted larger. You mentioned a 120, that would be a great size !

#2. The sand that you initially start off with will most likely be dead sand , meaning no live creatures ( worms,pods, or any type of bacteria ). One can seed this sand with a few cups/pounds of Live sand from others tanks - or with live rock.The inhabitants will quickly spread and seed your new sand and rock.

#3.Hmmm White Settelment ..I live in Keller and I use Pet - o - Rama - eulkess/bedford , Tranquilscape - Arlington,Saltwater paradise - Irving , and Ive been to Randys Fish Warehouse in Richland Hills but I didnt like his attitude.Theres another one in Ft.Worth but the name escapes me atm.Heres a hint : DONT BUY ANY FISH FROM Petco !! LOL they are always infected w/ich!

#4.The tanks under the aquariums are called " Sumps ". This is a place where you can put your heaters,administer water top-offs ,run carbon etc. It allows you to have greater water volume and therbye turning the water in your display over roughly 10 times per hour. More is better but 5-10x is good.I Highly reccomend getting a " Reef ready " tank.These tanks have holes drilled in them for your sump plumbing instead of having to use Hang on the back overflows to drain the water into from your display into your sump.

#5.You dont really want those glass covers on your tank, they will trap a layer of air between them and the waters surface and cause heat build up.Simply remove them. If you dont get a reef ready tank you will hang the items on the back of the tank . IE : protein Skimmers , heaters , and powerheads.

#6.Salt water ... Youll need an RO/DI system for fresh water top-offs and mixing salt. Your tap water is laced with heavy minerals and Phosphates that will be detrimental to your livestock. I currently just have a 5-Stage RO unit that I got off E-Bay for $80 and Its doing fine. others have more complex set-ups .Salt water is obtained by mixing Synthetic salt you buy from LFS IE: Oceanic , Instant ocean , and Kents to name a few. they can be bought at any LFS.

#7. 1st thing you need to get after you display is a MUST : Get Minimum 10 gal Quarintine Tank, 20 gal if you can.This cheap investment will save you hundreds of dollars in the end. Quarantine all newly purchased fish for a MINIMUM of 3 weeks.. trust me!Its to rid them of any diseases or parasites they may carry. You dump a fish in your tank from a LFS and it infests your tanks residents youll be cursing yourself !Also Id say a Protein skimmer is a Must have.

Go here for the rest of your questions:

www.reefcentral.com

they have a new to the hobby forum and there youll find all your answers.Its a bit confusing at 1st but youll get into the swing of things!

Good Luck

Andy]
 
[Just read read read. Also if your patient you can find some DARN good deals on this website when people sell off their tanks. Like 50% or more off retail.

Also, on the quarantine tank... This may be just me, but after 3 years in the hobby, Ive yet had a new fish infect my other fish with anything. Ive had the newfish stress out and get some ick or cloudy eye, but healthy and wellfed fish rarely ever fall prey to disease. In my humble opinion, it is much more important to be picky in what fish you get in the pet store.

A) make sure you see the fish eat at the store
B) pick out the best specimen possible, if they have the fish you want and it looks sick or wont eat, pass it up and wait.

Im part of the group who thinks it is much more important to get your new fish into a stable and natural-looking environment, your your reef tank, rather then stress them out more in a small undeveloped 10 gallon quaranteen tank. Just be very picky in what specimens you buy at the store.

Corals... well thats another subject :)]
 
[Welcome to the boards!!!

I also second the book reading! The New Marine Aquarium by Michael Palletta or The Conscientous Marine Aquarist by Robert Fenner are at the top of the list. You can probably get either of them from amazon.com

You can also read the marine aquarium articles here for tons of info.

I would definately start looking at some sites and pricing equipment before you go any further - youve been warned :laugh long:
Marine Depot and Champion lighting are good places to start. Have a look at different pumps, lighting, and protein skimmers before you dive right into this!

Andy, wont you pretty please with a peppermint(shrimp) on top tell the newbies four weeks! LOL :tongue:]
 
[Holy Sheeeeet! Your the luckiest person i know then!
My 1st purchase was laced w/ICH and totaly wiped out all 3 of the fish I bought.The $65 it cost me in fish would have been saved by a cheap $19 10 gal setup from Walmart. Then I had to let my tank lay fallow for 8 weeks to break the ICH cycle.Oh well what do i know anyways.I do know that I dont give a toss where the fish comes from hes going in QT for 3 weeks before it gets in my display.IMHO You just got lucky and continue to get lucky.Just my 2 cents worth.

BTW : Ive never lost a fish in my QT , However I have had a fish break out with ICH 2 weeks into the qt period and I doubt it was from the stress of being in a 10 gal tank .It was treated and qt'd for another additional 4 weeks and then put into my display.I do agree with you that buying quality fish makes a difference and you do reduce your chances of any disease/parasites. But Ill never go through tearing my display apart to catch diseased fish again.

Heres a great articles on Marine Qt:

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/quaranti.htm


http://www.wetwebmedia.com/QuarMarFishes.htm]



Edited By Maldivan on 1088222891
 
[Ok, I am not an expert by any stretch of the word, but I can give you my experience/knowledge thus far. First, you should stop and get some good books to read about the hobby (like Ron said). This will save you a lot of time and money in the long run. Also, when it comes to equipment (lighting, sumps, protein skimmers, etc), you do get what you pay for. Save up for the best possible. Diving into this hobby (no pun intended) is NOT what you want to do. It will be much more enjoyable if you take your time, research, and save up while you do that. The biggest expense will be in the beginning for setup. After that, you SLOWLY stock it with what you want.

First, good place to look for books at a lower cost (besides ebay or half.com) is:
Overstock.com

Second, here are some answers for your questions.

1. What size aquarium to get? This is a preference and space issue. The bigger the better…the more water, the longer it takes for things to “go bad” (ie. water parameters). But, the larger the tank, the more expensive it can get. Minimum size for a beginner is a 55 gallon. Also, you need to decide what kind of fish you want to keep. For example, Tangs take a larger tank for them to be happy when they are adults. Clownfish can be housed fine in a 55 gallon, some species of them can be bullies, so you will need to consider that when thinking of other tank mates. Be aware also that you can’t have as many fish in a saltwater tank as you can in a freshwater tank. The rule in marine is NOT 1 fish per gallon.
2. What does live sand do? Like live rock, live sand will help with natural biological filtration. Both will house good bacteria that help break down ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Live sand will house some clean up animals like worms. Live rock will house things called pods (often called “bugs”). These are some natural food for fish.
3. Fish stores: I have not been to it, but one store in Ft. Worth is Fish Paradise. They are a sponsor in this forum. Go to the Sponsor section and you can find their info.
4. The tanks in the cabinet below the aquarium are called sumps. However, you don’t put fish in them. It adds more water in the entire system (which is good). Also, it is a place you can hide equipment like your heater and protein skimmer. The water movement from tank down to sump and back also help with adding oxygen since you have running water and more surface area of water for oxygen transfer. (I know I didn’t say that right.)
5. How do you get the “accessories” attached to the tank? As mention in #4, if you have a sump, you can put the accessories in there. Also, not everybody use the glass top. Some use the plastic egg crate material and others don’t cover it at all. Whether you cover it or not many times depends on if you have fish that will jump out of the tank or not.
6. How do I make saltwater? First, get a large bucket that you can mix water in. Also, get a small submersible powerhead and heater (powerhead to keep water circulating and heater to keep it the same temperature as the tank temperature). You need to buy salt made for marine aquariums, like Instant Ocean or Oceanic. You definitely do NOT want to use tap water. Get yourself what is called an RO/DI unit (Reverse Osmosis/Deionization) so you can produce your own filtered water or you can tote jugs back and forth to the grocery store and fill up at their water machines (note: much easier and convenient to get your own RO/DI unit). I bought mine from
AirWaterIce
(I got the Typhoon III) You can also buy one from the president of the club, Marc. See his website at:
Melev's Reef

Continue with next post....(didn't want to pass maximum for post)]
 
[Part II

7. Tank—see #1 above. Lights—You need to decide what you want to keep in your tank like corals and types, clams, etc. Different things have different needs. Again, you need to decide what you want to keep in your tank—research, research, research. Keep asking questions out here, too. Fish are not required. You could have purely a coral reef. That is up to you. Water Filter—For marine aquariums, most use what is called a protein skimmer. This is another item you will need to research. Live Rock and Live Sand—see #2 above. Heater—depending on size of tank, you must get a certain wattage of heater. Also, some folks buy a chiller to keep their tanks cool enough. Lights can cause a lot of heat depending on the lighting you get and Texas summers can be harsh unless you want to keep your AC really cool for the entire house. Chillers ARE expensive. Chemicals—Many folks try to dose as few items as possible when it comes to chemicals. Many seem to just dose what’s called two part solutions that help with Calcium and Alkalinity. I don’t have time to explain Calcium and alkalinity, this is another thing you can research (oh fun, I know). If you do regular water changes, then other chemicals (actually minerals) are replaced by the new saltwater change because good salt mixes have them in it.
8. Inverts—These are things like snails, hermit crabs, shrimp, starfish, lobsters, clams, scallops, cucumbers, urchins, + more. The reason why you may have heard it is because inverts are more sensitive to water conditions (parameters) than most fish and corals.
9. Treated Rock vs Untreated Rock—Treated is what is called Cured and Untreated is called Uncured. You can get either. However, cured rock will help your tank to cycle faster. Whereas uncured will have some “die-off” or some things on it will die which means this will contribute to the cycling of the tank. Cycle is when your tank reading starts with high ammonia (test this with a test kit). Bacteria will naturally build up to take care of the ammonia. This bacteria turns it into Nitrite. Your ammonia reading will then be 0 and Nitrite (another test kit) will have a high reading. A different bacteria then builds up to convert nitrite to nitrate. You wait until the Nitrite reading goes to 0. The reason is because both ammonia and nitrite are deadly to fish, corals, and inverts. Nitrate is fairly harmless as long as it is not at extremely high levels. You must go through this cycling before you add any live items to your tank. Yet another thing to read up on. Yippee!
10. Rock—You do not have to fill a tank with live rock, but it will be harder (in my opinion) to keep the water basic parameters (ammonia, nitrite, nitrates) at correct levels. General rule is about 1.5 lbs per gallon. Honestly, the more the better.
11. This is definitely an item to research. As mention in answers above, you need to decide what you would like to keep. It is really hard to get fish out of a tank once they are in. Again, add fish slowly because your bacteria needs time to build up to take care of fish waste.

PS. Do we get together to see each others tanks….they are currently setting up tours I believe. One in the Ft. Worth area and another in the Dallas area.

Note that others have mentioned a quarantine tank. It is a good thing to have. You cannot put medications in your tank if a fish gets sick. They would need to be transferred to the quarantine tank (QT tank) to medicate. Also, this tank is used to put new fish in to make sure they are not sick or infected BEFORE putting them in the main tank. It can be a simple bare bottom 10 gallon tank that just has PVC pipes for hiding and a sponge filter. You don’t want to put clutter in it.

This may all be overwhelming, but they are things you need to know so you don’t make some of the mistakes we have nor waste money unnecessarily. Also, the hobby will be more rewarding and less frustrating if you start out on the right foot.

Welcome! You have started out right by asking questions.

Hope I helped somewhat….]
 
[Man oh man, what a thread!

Okay, to summarize:

What is a sump, and how does it work?

What is all this stuff, and what do I really need?

Why is White Setllement water bad for my tank? I lived there for 14 years, and that is the worst water I've ever tasted. Don't think for a minute you can use it for your aquarium, unless your goal is to grow algae. :cussing:

There is a place right by Ridgmar Mall called The Fish Place, but I refuse to shop there ever again. All I ever got was bad advice and contempt from the owner. When issues arose, my tank suffered. Fish Paradise is right off McCart and Alta Mesa in S/W Ft Worth.

To set up a tank with a variety of live stock, essentially setting up a reef tank, you will need Live Sand (dead/dry sand seeded with a few cups of live sand from an existing setup), Live Rock (fully cured is best), a quality protein skimmer (don't skimp on this one piece of equipment as it is the work horse of your system), and a refugium would be nice (not a necessity, but worth considering). Lighting varies with your needs, but we can sort that out later.

A smaller tank will run you less when it comes to equipment purchases. I've run a 29g for over 6 years now. See my tanks.

To figure out the heater you need, figure 3 watts per gallon. And playing it smart, take that total number and divide it by two. Buy two heaters that add up to the total wattage you need. That way if one fails, it won't cook your tank and kill your livestock.

The Tank Tour is taking place next Saturday (July 3), and you should come join in the fun.]
 
[Welcome to the forum board, glad to see you here, better yet glad your asking questions before you jump into this head first. This can be a expensive hobby and mistakes can be even more expensive!

OMG, where does one start with out writing a book here...

You got some very good answers from some knowledgable people. That should get you well on your way to a successful start.

1: I would recommend a 40 gallon Breeder as the smallest with 75 gallons being better. It has a great shape for aquascape and is large enough to avoid minor swings in paremeters of your water form snow balling into a disaster. Really bad things can happen in a tank and the smaller it is...the quicker it can happen. Generally speaking tall or skinny tanks are not a good thing. Avoid corner tanks and Octagon tanks. There are some out there that people have that are nice but they generally are difficult to fit lighting under and accessories and such.

2. Live rock and live sand are a very good thing especially in a reef tank (one with corals and fish). The more live rock and the lighter/more porus, the better. It looks cool after about 6 months when its covered in corlline algae anyways! The more holes, crevices and knarly looking it is the better as well. Live sand...its kinda pricey. I would suggest several bags of "dry" sand thats "dead" and pour a couple of bags of live sand on top of that. You get the most bang for the buck this way and I am a tightwad! What type...well thats your preferance. I DO NOT RECOMMEND crushed coral for sand. Its a nutrient sink in no uncertain terms and will require more attention than you will probably want to give it. Oolitic (sugar sized) is cool but its often too fine. I would suggest something in the middle 1.5 mm to .8 mm in diameter. DSB or no DSB, thats the question to ask and is highly debated in the hobby. I suggest you read and then read some more.

3: Cant help you there at the moment as Uncle Sam has seen fit to send me on a all expenses paid vacation to the Exotic Middle East, and I dont retire for 30 more days if I can stay alive that long. Sorry. Cant wait to get to DFW!!!

4: Sumps and Refugiums. These are a good thing too. Its also a great place to put all of your accessories such as heater skimmer and etc... so that you have a nice clean uncluttered display tank with minimal distration for your veiwing pleasure. I highly recommend both!

5: See #4 although most come in Hang On the Back (HOB) versions or with barckets to do this. This will create lots of clutter.

6: Normally your salt is mixed 2 cups per 5 gallons and this is usually pretty close to where you want it to be for Salinity. A salinity gauge or better yet a refractomer is manditory. You salt mix will have instructions...use them and you will be okay with minimal suprises. Use a mixing pump or powerhead and mix about 12-24 hours in advance in a new, clean garbage can, plastic type of course. You can use tap water that has been dechlorinated but its better to purchase RO/DI water or get a unit for making this type water. Tap wate can introduce lots of contaminates to your system that you DO NOT WANT in there.

7. Lights depends upon what your keeping. FO or FOWLR or Soft Coral Reef, Mixed Coral Reef or SPS/LPS and Clam tanks all require different light. My Clam/SPS 135 gallon tank has about at least 1500.00 dollars in retrofit Halides and VHO's using my simple arithmatic. FO and FOWLR you can use some pretty modest light set up. For Softies (Soft Corals) PC's, T-5 HO's, VHO's work very nicely and can be fairly reasonably priced. While you can do SPS and some Clams under VHO's or even PC's you wont really realize their true potential or be overly successful unless you use Halides. The difference is phenominal! Choose your lighting wisely as its usually one of the most expensive things you will buy for your tank!

8: Inverts...you need these guys as they are what keeps your tank looking pretty and algae free. I use one snail per a gallon, 1 hermit per .75 gallons, 1 Fighting Conch per 50 gallons, and one Star Fish for sand sifting per 50 gallons. This ratio has worked for me great. Your "mileage" may vary. But get a good clean up crew before you start adding fish and corals. The "bad algae" game is not very fun to play and these are the guys who keep it under control!

9: Cured vs Uncrured live rock. If you get your rock from the local fish store then cured live rock in my opinion is a good deal. Buying on line? Might as well get uncured becuase by the time cured rock gets to you there will be signifagant die off and it will cycle your tank again! Plus its cheaper.

10: Yeah, what buyitjody said!

11: Did someone mention QT tank? If you dont get one you WILL sooner or later, trust me on that one! Belive me its far easier to treat a critter in a QT than it is to treat the whole tank, especially if it is a reef tank of some sort. It can be a simple as a 10 gal tank with a small filter and small light and prehaps a PVC pipe elbow for a fish to use as shelter while being treated. A QT tank will give you many more options for treatment as well without negatively impacting your display. Your tank only needs to crash and burn once to make you a believer in a QT tank! Get one!!!

This is a great place to get some info, you got a lot of good feed back here. Read as much as you possible can, hit the forums and skim through the post as every question you have asked and will probably ask is on a forum board some where. One of the best things I can suggest is to go on a "reef tour" and check out some of the members tanks. See what it is that you like or dont like, ask questions about thier set up. They will be more than willing to do a "data dump" on you, and no matter how much you know...you will probably learn something new anyways, I know I sure do. Too it will give you a lot of ideas. This is not the cheapest hobby to get into but it doesnt have to be that expensive either. (I have dumped close to 10K on 4 tanks and thats not counting the frags I sold to finance this habit) There are places you can cut corners and there are places you cant.

Good luck and HTH's]



Edited By Imaexpat2 on 1088325591
 
[First, I want to say thanks to everyone for thier great input. It has helped me think about everything involved in the hobby including $ and time, what is needed, and what to do and not to do.

I do have some more questions that yours answers have triggered or that i've thought of since I first posted - not as many as the first round thought :)

1) Can too much stuff grow out of a live rock? IE: can so much come out of a live rock that it starts to "take over" the tank. I had a friend that said he had stuff on almost every part of his rock and it cluttered things up. I saw it on occassion and there was grass like stuff spreading everywhere. It was not the most well kept tank unfortunately but there was alot from the rocks.

2) Are the fish, snails, rocks, coral, etc hard to feed? Do you even need to feed the snails, rocks, coral, sand, etc? Does every fish, snail, etc need to be feed different things? IE: I have 5 fish and 5 fish food types. Unlike freshwater where almost everything eats flakes.

3) What does "reef compatible" mean? I was looking on a web-site that gave a brief descriptions of fish and one category was "Is reef compatible"? What does that mean?

4) IMAEXPAT2 listed a lot of ratio's for invertibrate to keep tank clean. Do they go towards the 1" fish per 3-5 gallon rule or are they "free" in that sense? Also, are his ratios such that you got them all based on your tank size or enough to add up to your tank size? (I think he meant former in which you get some of all).

5) Is the difference between cured and uncured rock letting it set in water? IE: If I take uncured rock, put in saltwater for 4 weeks by itself, is it now cured?

6) Here are some fish I was thinking about getting - or like them b/c of thier colors...
Tomato Clownfish / Flame Dwarf Angel / Yellow Stripe Scollopsis / 3 Spot Domino Damselfish / Fire Damselfish / Sergeant Major Damselfish / Blue Tang / Powder Blue Tang / Convict Tang / Whitecheek Tang / Clown Triggerfish / Bicolor Pseudochromatis / Read Head Solon Fairy Wrasse / Scotts Velvet Wrasse / Blue Jaw Tilefish Dartfish

On the descriptions it would often say, dont keep this fish with any other of its type and if you want more of the same (IE: exact same kind) put them in all together. I think a lot of the tangs were like this. Does that mean if I put the Powder Blue Tang in the tank I can have a Blue or Convict Tang? Is that right?

Thanks for everyone's help. Much appreciated.]
 
[1) -- he was growing algae, which can take over a tank. It can be caused by many things.. bad water, too much lighting

2) I don't find my fish hard to feed but they do eat different things. My lion fish only eats live food, so I have to head to the pet store at least once a week for feeder fish. My trigger and wrasse eat a mixed diet so I have several different foods, dried and frozen to mix up and feed them. Also have a different food for the aenomes in the tank which has to be target (use a syringe to get it to them before the fish eat it) fed. Sounds difficult with all the foods, but it really isn't. You mentioned tangs in your "wants" list, I don't have one but from what I have read they are a bit pickier and harder to feed. Maybe someone can comment on that.

3) Reef compatible means the fish won't eat your corals etc that occupy the rocks. For example, I have a wrasse which cannot be identified. Noone knows what he is and he has been ok with anemones. However, we recently added a rock with a lot of anthelia. He is having a buffett at the moment as he is NOT reef compatible.

4) This one I will leave to the more experienced. I personally believe it depends on what you have. If you have fish that eat a lot, -- triggers, groupers etc, they produce a lot of waste. In turn, unless you have a super filtration system, you need to have less fish so you don't crash your system.

5) my understanding is yes

6) The 3 spot damsel is a great beginner fish as you can use it while the tank cycles as with I believe any other damsel. They do tend to be aggressive as they get bigger and most take them out of their tanks once cycled. I would if I could catch mine. The other fish you mentioned I don't know much about but I am sure you will get some input on them from here.

Good luck with your tank!! It is an addictive hobby.]
 
[1. or Aiptasia, all of these things can be controlled though, and/or maintained by helpful fish and critters.

2. I never recommend live food as it can corrode the liver. Other than that I find it easy to feed my fish a good mix of food that I make myself or snag from Nick when I can. I also feed the tangs seaweed which is a neccesary part of tang diet. It is kindof like flat paper that you fold and put in a clip for them to nibble on all day.
Certain fish do require different things but when you get into it, it really wont be that difficult to have a nice group of fish that feed on similar things.

3. Lyssa, I would love to see a pic of your wrasse!

4. Its not a definate science here - we all just buy the inverts that we know will do the job that needs done. When your tank is cycled start a thread for clean up crew recommendations.

5. yes

6. There are several species of fish that will not tolerate conspecifics(species of their own kind). Most tangs do fall into this category. You cant have all the fish on your list without a very large system, after you get setup pick your favorites and go from there.
I would avoid damselfish altogether, as they are very aggressive, grow big and ugly and you will never get them back out!
The bicolor psuedochromis is a very territorial fish, I would recommend the royal gramma instead and still add it close to last.
I love Tomato clowns and have a pair in one of my tanks. They are hardy and so far have gotten along with the rest of my fish great.
Clown trigger gets larger than a football easily and are very aggressive. They need very large tanks with appropriate food to keep their teeth filed down.
Jawfish dig burrows in the sand and can cause rock collapses - a nightmare in a reef tank but an awesome fish if you arent worried about that kind of thing.

I really advise reading Robert Fenners Concientous Marine Aquarist - it will answer questions that you may never think of!
Good Luck!]
 
[Dont put a clown trigger, or any other trigger in your reef, unless you dont like your inverts.

Dont call corals "plants". :) Corals are animals. they have "plants" living inside of them however. Thats why corals need light. Light feeds the "plants" the plants give off waste, which feed the coral.]
 
[Some more questions (getting fewer and fewer - thanks for everyone's help)...

1) How much does it cost to maintain a tank per month in food, replacement bulbs, filter, chemicals, etc? A) for 58-65 gallon tank with rock, sand, corals (I guess), and 4-5 fish. B) 120 gallon tank with rock, sand, corals, and 10 fish.

2) Will corals (like anemone's) grow out of the live rock? My friend had a saltwater tank and he got all kinds of cool things to grow out of his live-rock -- or at least that was my impression. IE: I dont think they specifically bought any.

3) Where is a good place to buy "dead" rock (rock that will become live rock over time if placed near already live rock)? Same question for sand?

4) I read that you want to have the tank in a dark place as if its next to sunlight, it will have temperature swings, algae blooms etc. How is this realistically possible as most houses have windows almost everywhere? I do have a panty room that has no window but is also where washer and dryer is and I wouldnt think that would be a good place due to detergent in air or whatever. Plus, not the place you want to have to go to enjoy your tank. Or is this suggesting not to put right under a window but the "interior" of a living room is ok. More detail on placement would be helpful.

5) Below is the order of which I think things need to be done, if you can make any corrections or add things i've forgotten, I would appreciate it (assuming have tank and stand built and in hand etc)...

My tank is not reef ready (?) and thus everything will have to hand on the back of the tank...

A) Use RO/DI unit to make "good" water.
B) Mix water with salt stuff per directions to make saltwater for tank and put in tank.
C) Run filters and pumps to cycle water. Wait how long?
D) Put in live/dead sand and live/dead rock into tank and install lights but only have on 1/2 as long as normal. Install protein skimmer / filter (?)
E) Wait to cycle. How long?
F) While in step E, check water stuff, pH, temp, etc over time to make sure its constant.
G) Buy fish (in correct order depending on what all is being bought) and put in QT tank.
H) Let settle. How long?
I) Goto step G until all fish etc in tank.
J) Enjoy tank.

Thanks to everyone for thier help in this endevour.]
 
[1) How much does it cost to maintain a tank per month in food, replacement bulbs, filter, chemicals, etc? A) for 58-65 gallon tank with rock, sand, corals (I guess), and 4-5 fish. B) 120 gallon tank with rock, sand, corals, and 10 fish? This depends on what lighting you are going to purchase and what tankmates you will have. The life of a bulb is only so long even if it is still burning. For example, I have power compacts. The bulbs should be replaced yearly. I have 4 bulbs and they are about $25 a piece, so that is approx. $100 a year (~$8.33 a month). I believe metal halides have a longer life, but they are more expensive per bulb. Different fish have different eating habits. Some will eat anything: flakes, frozen, etc. Others, like the lion fish, may only eat live, so you will have to purchase feeder fish/shrimp weekly. Corals normally like phytoplankton a couple times a week and other critters in the rock will also feed on the plankton. Animals like anemones will need to be spot fed a couple times a week with frozen silverside or krill… Until we know exactly what your setup will be, this is a hard number to calculate. Of course, the more you stock in your tank (or if you have a larger tank with more inhabitants), the more it will cost, but I wouldn’t think once you have all your equipment, live rock, and sand, the cost of maintance will not be astronomically different.

2) Will corals (like anemone's) grow out of the live rock? My friend had a saltwater tank and he got all kinds of cool things to grow out of his live-rock -- or at least that was my impression. IE: I dont think they specifically bought any. You will have some things grow out of your LIVE rock. However, if you are wanting to have a reef, you will need to buy some corals. Most items do not magically show up for you (as much as we wish it all did).

3) Where is a good place to buy "dead" rock (rock that will become live rock over time if placed near already live rock)? Same question for sand?
Not sure where to buy dead rock for a good price. Dallas North Aquarium had some, but I do not know the price and they are usually high in price for things in general. Look at the sponsors on our board for live rock though. Vincent at Tranquil Scape in Arlington has LOTS of live rock to choose from.

4) Basically, you don’t want to set up your tank right next to a window because of heat from the sun, etc. Putting it in the living room in the middle or on an interior wall is fine

5) My tank is not reef ready (?) and thus everything will have to hand on the back of the tank... Actually, you can still set up a sump by using what’s called an overflow/prefilter box. That way you won’t have to hang everything off the tank or in the tank.

Steps:
A) Use RO/DI unit to make "good" water.
B) Mix water with salt stuff per directions to make saltwater for tank and put in tank.
C) Set up and run filters and pumps.
D) Put in live/dead sand and live/dead rock into tank (you probably want to add sand and rock right before you add water…then pour water in slowly or you will have a cloudy sandstorm in the tank) and install lights but only have on 1/2 as long as normal. Install protein skimmer / filter (?)
E) Put in dead shrimp from seafood counter (plain shrimp, no spices, etc. – FRESH). Wait to cycle. How long? This is different for each tank. You will need to check Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate with test kits. When ammonia and nitrite are 0 and nitrates are not excessively high, then your tank is cycled. The more cured live rock and live sand you start with, the shorter the time in general.
F) While in step E, check water stuff, pH, temp, etc over time to make sure its constant.
G) Buy fish (in correct order depending on what all is being bought) and put in QT tank. Buy fish one at a time. Your tank needs to get used to the load of that fish before you move on to the next. If you put in too many in at one time, then you could cause another cycle which may or may not kill the fish.
H) Let settle. How long in QT tank? This depends on who you ask. Some say a couple weeks, some say a month.
I) Goto step G until all fish etc in tank.
J) Enjoy tank.

Hope that helps...]
 
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