Setting up new reef tank question - How would you start over?

J

JumboAg99

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[This may be a "loaded" question, but I'm going to ask it anyway. :D

I'm still on my training wheels tank (A 10G nano) and will probably be for several more months, but am looking towards the future.

I plan to set up something in the 65-100 gallon range within the next 6 months.

Here's my question (it might be more suited for Reef Central, but I'm going to ask here first):

What would YOU recommend? Spending the money for a TBS package for a tank that size? Buying just LR from somewhere like Gulf View or someone more local.

The + of something like TBS is all of the hitchhikers and assorted other stuff. The - of TBS is the same thing (EVIL critters that I will have to catch and destroy.)


Here's your chance to give advice to a newbie to help him avoid your mistakes!!! What do YOU think??]
 
[You can get some great deals On-Line thats for sure! You could order the LR say...from Gulf-view or anyplace that sells it cheap and cure it in a 50 gal rubbermaid container from wallmart ( $13 ) while your waiting to get your larger tank going.It can take up to a month for it to cure and when its done you wont have to go through a MAJOR Cycle when your ready for the 65-100 gal.You could do 30 LBS from Gulfview ( corraline encrusted ) , and 60 lbs of base rock from Hi-rocks and cure them togather in the 50 gal container w/a powerhead and heater for around $200. That way you could inspect the LR and pick off unwanted hitchers while its curing and also youd be seeding the base rock at the same time.

OR you can get great deals here on the board from people selling LR for around $3 a pound and put it into a rubbermaid container and let it seed any base rock that you may buy.You have time , and thats the good thing! It can all be curing / seeding while you get ready for the big move.If it were me doing it all over again i'd be watching this board like a hawk for people selling LR , Id have my container up and running and waiting. Id buy around $100 worth of LR from local reefers , then Id evaluate how much base rock I would need. I'd buy it and toss it into the container and let the LR seed it. Keep in mind you dont need base rock, its just cheaper than reg LR.]
 
[I agree with Andy. That is almost the route that I took in this hobby. I found base rock and pieces of live rock on this forum over a three month period. I put it all in together and seeded everything with some of the "Grunge" from GARF.org.
I have had some pretty good results, just remember to go slow and you will be happier. I have not heard of anyone who rushed into this and did not take longer to get it going.

Except Marc and the 14 day 280 miracle. :nod:]
 
[I think one of the biggest mistakes people make that can cause failure is lack of water flow. tank volume 10x / hour is a minimum IMO

Rather then loading your tank up with powerheads, consider a closed loop with multiple returns with via SCWD or other water direction changing device or a manifold around the top of the tank.]
 
[
Except Marc and the 14 day 280 miracle. said:
Marc doesn't count. :D
He's as far beyond me in knowledge as I am beyond my dog.

salsini - "TBS" is Tampa Bay Saltwater. They're a company out of Florida.]
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[I have ordered TBS and it's ok. When I first started everyone talked about it on reefcentral and said how awesome it was. I bought about 45lbs and wasn't that impressed because it seems like I spent more time getting the bad stuff out (crabs, mantis, and algae). I did get a nice pod population and a couple of coco worms, but nothing that all that impressive. If I had it to do over again I would buy the rock from the LFS or a different online vendor and just seed it with some other live rock.]
 
[I would just buy cheap fiji rock. It will eventually become covered in corals so it does not matter much what is looks like. TBS is a ripoff compared to gulfview but neither are they great of a deal. Lots of life and lots of bad guys.
The TBS and the Gulfview rock does not need to be cured. Most WS fiji rock will cure in a couple weeks. Clean, water with lots of flow and lots of light will yield fast results. I would also skip the sandbed. I cannot wait to get rid of mine.

I think rule # 1 should be dont try to be cheap. This is not the hobby to try and nickle and dime. Buy quality equiptment up front, then you have no need to have to replace the crappy equiptment you started with. Also would skip the closed loop and maxijets and just buy a properly sized tunze. Lastly when you upgrade dont waste you $$ on PC lighting.]



Edited By mmiller40 on 1094854952
 
[Echoing Mitch, don't be cheap. Get a very high quality skimmer (Euroreef, ASM, AquaC, etc.) Get metal halides, get Tunze's. This will allow you to keep anything you want and you won't have to upgrade your equipment! Agree with the flow statements also. Get a ton of flow in there. 10x minumum and try to get 20-30x. This helps solve a lot of problems by keeping the food/deitrus suspended so it is either skimmed out or eaten.

As far as rock. I got the TBS package. I wouldn't do it again. It is nice for a while but it does have lots of unwanted hitchikers (mantis, crabs) and comes with crushed coral which is not ideal in my opinion. Go cheap, it will get covered with corals anyway.

This is purely my opinion but I would go with a snail only cleanup crew. I'm sick of my crabs munching my snails.

Have a sump/refugium. Get tons of pods and many other benefits such as nutrient export.

Sandbed or no sandbed is a matter of choice in my opinion but I will say many people are going back to bare bottoms or very little substrate due to problems with their sand beds.]
 
[I just saw a thread advertising about 300lbs of LR for $3/lb. I'd suggest you start with that, but expect it to have some issues since that tank crashed for some reason.

The rest of the advice in this thread is sound.]
 
[Just a side note on the flow. I do l;ike the x10-X20 flow thats mentioned above. If you do plan on having this much flow make sure yopur sump can handle it.I started with 1600GPH Pump on my 100 gal and at 5' I was still pumping out 1300 gph at a turnover ratio of x13 JUST on my return pump.It was going into a 29 Gal sump and OMG was it turbulent through there. I was unable to control the flow through the fuge into the return area and it was like niagra falls ! I added a baffle after the fuge to force the water down but still it was too powerfull. had I gotten say...a 55 gal sump the all would have been fine since the water would have had another 18" to travel and calm down.30" in the 29 gal sump wasnt enough.I eventually went down to a Mag9 and at 1.5" return hose @5' head pressure in turning over x8 and it seems to be very nice.

http://www.dfwmas.org....a+falls

I guess with my return pump and 2xmaxijet 1200 I have 1400 gph flow in the tank but I dont know if you can count powerheads as flow.

Andy]
 
[Yes your MJ's count as flow. Your return counts as flow also but it is not necessary to have a huge return pump. Honestly a mag 12 as my return is more than enough. A mag 9 would work just fine, I even used a mag 7 when I my mag 12 impellor broke. My tank currently has mag 12 return and 2 1600 GPH Tunze 6060 for a total of 4400gph. I also run 2 MJ1200's in dead spots.]
 
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