Refugium sand bed

S

salsini

[I am setting up a new refugium, Is Miracle Mud worth the money? Should I use live rock rubble? How about bare bottom with one big rock?

I want to get lots of pods and grow healthy macro.

Low water flow or high water flow?]
 
[I've never used miracle mudd but from what I understand you have to periodically replace it. It's great in one of their hang on system but I think not well suited in a typical set up.

I base that statement solely on when I removed my sand bed from my sump. It triggered several problems.

A bare bottom refugium defeats the purpose. The phosphates and nitrates rise. Entering the overflow where they are sucked into the sump. The refugium utilizes green life to remove those particles and they depened on substrate of some sort. Live rock should be a must in anyones refugium.

This comes off like I am an expert but I am not. I am still in the experiment stage "with the what works for me" on this topic. In about 2 years I will have some results on the CPW if it indeed works?]
 
[I really think Miracle Mud is overpriced and the tanks that I've seen using it were not impressive at all. I would recommend a 2" sand bed in your refugium instead.]
 
[[/quote]Low water flow or high water flow?
This question has been discussed quite a bit on other boards. IMO I think a good swift flow is the way to go. I know that a chiller is more efficient when the water is moving faster over the refrigerant coils so I believe that quicker flow through a refugium is the way to go. However said:
Is Miracle Mud worth the money?

Quote:
I personally feel that it is not. I know that the manufacturer recommends that the mud be replaced periodically to maintain a good filter. I think equal results can be acheived with sand. Just remember that neither are setups that can run forever without being replaced.]
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[I have not used ot even seen the product, but from what I have read, I will add it to the same category as "bacteria in a bottle".

On the same note I saw some "live wet sand" and planted aquarium gravel with 'bacteria' in it at Exotic last night...it was hard not to laugh...maybe I am wrong and there is a point to it...I guess at the very least its cleaner. (commercially bagged on the dry goods shelves)]
 
[I looked at the Miracle Mud and followed threads and so forth - the talk was that it was great for refugiums and seemed to prevent tank crashes at the 2 and 3 year marks - the thinking was that it was due to the high levels of iron in itas well as other 'trace minerals'.
I admit it, I bought some - hey, I was new to the hobby and didn't know any better and had more money than knowledge at that point. I wouldn't buy it again...]
 
[
the talk was that it was great for refugiums and seemed to prevent tank crashes at the 2 and 3 year marks said:
Often caused by DSB's that are not deep. Extensive research has been done by various people and the general feeling is a DSB needs to be over 4" deep, or you will have problems a few years down the line. Not sure how deep they recommend having the 'mud' but I'd imagine this may be part of it, nothing magical in the mud itself just how its used.]
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[I disagree with Marc, I would still go with a DSB the same reduction should occur. Infact, more should occur in the sump as oppposed to the top tank as that is where most of the bad goes. Though your green life will absorb alot too it may not be nessesary. Also plant diversity is good in the sump and some plants have deep root structures.

p.s. I wrote this late again, when I should learn to keep my mouth shut!

I have seen people that swear by miracle mud and have great tanks???]
 
[For the most part, a DSB is effective because of the larger footprint. The small footprint of a refugium simply won't have the ability to process compared to a display tank.

Btw, my 55g has 0 nitrates today. My refugium is 2" deep, my display is 4" deep, and my cheatomorpha is pretty densely grown. I did harvest some for others recently, but it will fill in again soon.]
 
[@Marc wrote:
For the most part said:
I might qualify that statement by adding that it obviously depends on the size of refugium you had planned. If I remember correctly, I've seen tanks(100g-180g) that were built around the "miracle mud" with refugiums on the order of 55gal and up. I think a really diverse and active sandbed in a 55g refugium could process waste from your typical 180g. I've got no proof of that, just an opinion.

If you're just looking for a place for pods and other critters to survive, I think the Miracle Mud would be a waste of money. You could use a little sand some rubble and rock. Or even just rock, though the more places you have for critters to live, the greater diversity you will enjoy. IOW, I'd use some sand in there.

If you are going for NO3 reduction as your primary goal, then you're gonna need a DSB in there. All up to you!]
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[I agree Duane, in that I'm always assuming it is small refugium. The one under my 55g is only 5g. The one under my smaller reef is about 8g.

But people with fish rooms or basements with 200g vats merely to run a refugium would have amazing results due to the larger surface area.]
 
[Both. Definitely in the 115, because of the larger footprint.]
 
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